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<v Speaker 1>This is parent Data. I'm Emily Ost. Hello Mandy Moore.

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<v Speaker 2>Hello Emily Oster.

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<v Speaker 1>I'd love you to tell people who you are and.

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<v Speaker 2>What kind of kids you have. My name is Mandy Moore.

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<v Speaker 2>I am a parent of two boys, Gus who's three

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<v Speaker 2>and Ozzie, who is seventeen months. And my late night

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<v Speaker 2>panic Google has to do with croup. Gus, my older son,

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<v Speaker 2>has had croup for my gosh, you got it maybe

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<v Speaker 2>for the first time when he was around two, and

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<v Speaker 2>now every time he starts to get sick, it just

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<v Speaker 2>goes directly to croup. Like this past week, he woke

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<v Speaker 2>up on Monday, like after his nap, post post school

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<v Speaker 2>and just wheezing and the you know signature creepy cough.

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<v Speaker 2>So it sounds like a seal, It sounds like it.

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<v Speaker 1>Seals like a sparking meal.

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<v Speaker 2>And so my late night panic Google has to do

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<v Speaker 2>with is this ever going to end? Will he grow

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<v Speaker 2>out of croup? Does this mean he is prone to

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<v Speaker 2>be asthmatic? When is this all going to end? I mean,

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<v Speaker 2>we have a nebulizer at home and now we have

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<v Speaker 2>medication to sort of treat it. We've gone to the

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<v Speaker 2>hospital twice, so it's it's still it keeps me up

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<v Speaker 2>at night because it's it's still terrifying. And yeah, so

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<v Speaker 2>my my, my late night panic Google has to do

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<v Speaker 2>with when is this going to end? Will he grow

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<v Speaker 2>out of it? Doesn't mean he's gonna have asthma.

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<v Speaker 1>So your late and panic Google is like a is

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<v Speaker 1>a really is like a real panic Google in this.

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<v Speaker 1>I mean it's just like in the sense that I

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<v Speaker 1>think so much of what people are up late at

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<v Speaker 1>night googling is things where the answer is like, yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>baby's poof can be whatever color. But this is something

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<v Speaker 1>we're actually like if there are situations if you do

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<v Speaker 1>have to go to the hospital or bring them outside

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<v Speaker 1>or something else. Just to give people some context. So,

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<v Speaker 1>croup is something you get as a result of other infection,

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<v Speaker 1>other viruses. Is that right?

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<v Speaker 2>Yes?

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<v Speaker 1>Yes, that is your Okay.

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<v Speaker 2>Yes, that's what That's what I know. That's what you're So.

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<v Speaker 1>Croup is like a symptomatic cough that happens and kids

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<v Speaker 1>have basically there like it's too hard for them to breathe,

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<v Speaker 1>and then they need a nebulizer or they need sometimes

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<v Speaker 1>you can help if they go outside, and sometimes you

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<v Speaker 1>need to go to the hospital. Yes, so the good

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<v Speaker 1>news is that it's almost always occurs in kids under six,

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<v Speaker 1>and the peak time is like six months to three years.

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<v Speaker 1>So actually, like er visits in the US, about one

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<v Speaker 1>point three percent of pediatric er visits are for group

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<v Speaker 1>so like, you are not you are not panic googling.

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<v Speaker 1>You are not panic googling alone in this case, which

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<v Speaker 1>is perhaps reassuring, although I never find that like quite

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<v Speaker 1>as reassuring as wouldn't that it was. But almost half

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<v Speaker 1>of those are in kids under two, and then in

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<v Speaker 1>another about half is kids like two to seven, and

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<v Speaker 1>then basically it's a very small share after that. Great,

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<v Speaker 1>so you more or less have a couple years of this. Unfortunately,

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<v Speaker 1>this is like a true late night panic google because

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<v Speaker 1>your business for this are.

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<v Speaker 2>Almost always at night.

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<v Speaker 1>Oh of course, almost always like ten pm to four am.

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<v Speaker 1>Your kid never needs to go to the er like

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<v Speaker 1>at two o'clock afternoon. Yep, like you're available to take

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<v Speaker 1>them there. Yeah, So that's that's good. Uh, that's that

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<v Speaker 1>feels like you're growing out of it. What about the

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<v Speaker 1>other kid?

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<v Speaker 2>He knock on wood at this point hasn't exhibited any

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<v Speaker 2>of those symptoms. And it's funny because I know that

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<v Speaker 2>like some kids can get croup, it's the result of

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<v Speaker 2>other viruses or infections or whatever and never really happen again.

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<v Speaker 2>But then there is like a small, select, little sliver

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<v Speaker 2>of kids that are just prone to get it over

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<v Speaker 2>and over again, and unfortunately, I think that's Gus's case.

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<v Speaker 2>And then I kind of have done some light reading,

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<v Speaker 2>and my understanding is that like sometimes it goes hand

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<v Speaker 2>in hand with being asthmatic. So I guess that was

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<v Speaker 2>just my other half of the question was like, does

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<v Speaker 2>this mean that he's going to have childhood asthma? Is

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<v Speaker 2>that something I should look out for? That freaks me

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<v Speaker 2>out as well because I don't have asthma. My husband

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<v Speaker 2>had it as a kid, so it's like that's a

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<v Speaker 2>whole new world to me as well.

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<v Speaker 1>So for something like this, there's this sort of like, yes,

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<v Speaker 1>there's an increase, but also like there are a lot

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<v Speaker 1>of other factors that would matter. So there are many

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<v Speaker 1>other things that associated with asthma, like parental asthma is

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<v Speaker 1>a very significant risk factor, other allergies, other like allergenic diseases,

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<v Speaker 1>like if they have a lot of eggs of U,

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<v Speaker 1>so there's a bunch of that correlate with asthma, and

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<v Speaker 1>so there's like a a relatively small increase, but a

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<v Speaker 1>huge Another way to say this, like a huge share

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<v Speaker 1>of kids have group who don't ultimately develop asthma. Okay,

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<v Speaker 1>And so it's like, you know, it's like one of

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<v Speaker 1>these complicated things where you say, like we would talk

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<v Speaker 1>about an increased risk, and even that increased risk could

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<v Speaker 1>sound big. You could sound like doubling or something. I

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<v Speaker 1>don't think it is in this case, but it could

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<v Speaker 1>sound it could sound large. But actually, like I could

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<v Speaker 1>tell you about baysy and updating, which is probably like

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<v Speaker 1>too much this podcast. But there's this idea that when

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<v Speaker 1>we see some common symptom, sure, then the question is

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<v Speaker 1>like what do you learn from a common symptom? So

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<v Speaker 1>here's like an example, all right, think about people showing

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<v Speaker 1>up with.

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<v Speaker 2>A headache, like a bad headache at the hospital.

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<v Speaker 1>Sure, if you have a brain tumor, you are very

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<v Speaker 1>likely to have a bad headache, but almost everyone with

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<v Speaker 1>a bad headache does not have a brain tumor. Got it.

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<v Speaker 1>And so there's the sense in which like, yes, there's

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<v Speaker 1>an increased risk of brain tumor with a bad headache,

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<v Speaker 1>because like that is one of the symptoms. But if

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<v Speaker 1>you asked, what should I learn about brain tumor risk

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<v Speaker 1>from my headache, the answer is like nothing, got it?

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<v Speaker 1>So this is a little bit like that in the

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<v Speaker 1>sense that, like you know, like, yes, there is an

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<v Speaker 1>increased risk, but a huge How likely should you think

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<v Speaker 1>that is as a result of the group.

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<v Speaker 2>Some of the other symptoms got it?

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<v Speaker 1>Got it exactly. The basy and stuff is still relatively small,

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<v Speaker 1>given that you don't have any other any other symptoms.

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<v Speaker 2>See, we did like some get a base roll.

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<v Speaker 1>These rules like very important.

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<v Speaker 2>I love it. It's such good statistics.

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<v Speaker 1>I don't know what else on your mind?

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<v Speaker 2>All right, Do we did croup? You got any other problems? No?

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<v Speaker 2>That was it. That was like the big thing that

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<v Speaker 2>in my household that has been top of mind lately.

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<v Speaker 2>Did the kids?

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<v Speaker 1>Did your kids sleep pretty well? Even when when they're

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<v Speaker 1>not creepy.

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<v Speaker 2>They knock on wood? Yes, we've been very, very lucky.

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<v Speaker 2>We've always had good, good sleepers. We did sleep train

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<v Speaker 2>them early, and that like kind of I think set

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<v Speaker 2>the foundation for everything. They've always been pretty great about that.

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<v Speaker 2>We're about to switch to a toddler bed though, Is

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<v Speaker 2>there any like any advice in that regard because we're

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<v Speaker 2>my husband and I are terrified and we've just been

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<v Speaker 2>like waiting. It's probably way too because she's in a

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<v Speaker 2>cage and he's in a cage.

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<v Speaker 1>Yes, yeah, so it is true that after you get

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<v Speaker 1>them in the top then they can then they can leave. Yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>I think for it's like all these things, like having

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<v Speaker 1>a consistent response is basically the key. So if they

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<v Speaker 1>come out, I will tell you. With my daughter, we

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<v Speaker 1>switch to a childtherer bed and then like the first

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<v Speaker 1>day she came out, and you know, she came out

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<v Speaker 1>of her room like during nap and we're like, oh, no,

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<v Speaker 1>you're not allowed to leave the bed at all. That's

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<v Speaker 1>ever like the rule with the bed is you can't

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<v Speaker 1>leave the bed. And she was like okay, And you know,

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<v Speaker 1>I had like a sort of like a very type

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<v Speaker 1>a like three year old. She was like, okay, I'm not.

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<v Speaker 2>Going to leave the bed.

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<v Speaker 1>And then like we only learned like much much later.

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<v Speaker 1>We were trying to pitty train her at night. We

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<v Speaker 1>were like, hey, you know, would you be interested in

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<v Speaker 1>using the bathroom at night, you know, like not having diapers,

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<v Speaker 1>and she was like, you know, like do you think

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<v Speaker 1>you would wake up for and she was like, oh,

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<v Speaker 1>I always wake up, but you told me not to

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<v Speaker 1>leave the bed, so I haven't been going to the bathroom.

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<v Speaker 2>Oh, because she's like, oh no, we went too far.

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<v Speaker 2>That backfired, Yeah, get backfired. So maybe there's a balance.

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<v Speaker 1>But I do think there's a sense when they switched

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<v Speaker 1>to the bed that you just, you know, tell them

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<v Speaker 1>that they actually like, telling them that they can't leave,

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<v Speaker 1>and then sort of consistently returning them to the bed

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<v Speaker 1>if they try a few times. Like you know, if

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<v Speaker 1>your kid already understands about staying in their bed, you'd

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<v Speaker 1>probably be fine.

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<v Speaker 2>I'm more concerned with him leaving the room.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, sure, so I think that's you also put them

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<v Speaker 1>back in the room.

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<v Speaker 2>Correct, Yeah, that's that's the bigger deal. I'm he could

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<v Speaker 2>get out of his bed and he can go potty

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<v Speaker 2>if he needs to. But yeah, I think we're just

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<v Speaker 2>it's such a huge milestone and such a big shift.

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<v Speaker 2>Like he's been in a crib his whole life and

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<v Speaker 2>he's never tried to climb out. But we just feel

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<v Speaker 2>like he's three. He's a big boy. He's like independent

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<v Speaker 2>and all, you know, and all these other facets of

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<v Speaker 2>his life that it's just time to make that change

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<v Speaker 2>if it feels like he's not a baby anymore. So

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<v Speaker 2>I think we're just ready to pull the plug, but

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<v Speaker 2>terrified of doing it.

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<v Speaker 1>I feel like it's this. I have these friends who

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<v Speaker 1>really like the swaddle and who like never wanted to

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<v Speaker 1>give up the swaddle, and we're like at the point

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<v Speaker 1>of like buying like swaddles for a ten month old

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<v Speaker 1>from like some lady on Etsy.

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<v Speaker 2>You know. I the only person who would.

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<v Speaker 1>Like she was like big off brand because they're so big,

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<v Speaker 1>and it was like eventually like you know what, it's time,

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<v Speaker 1>It's time to let it.

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<v Speaker 2>Go, time to let it go. Yeah, we're very much

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<v Speaker 2>in that camp. We're ready.

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<v Speaker 1>I basically if you have if you have like good

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<v Speaker 1>sleep hygiene, it just continues. Yeah, okay, good, that's my take.

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<v Speaker 1>Thank you, This is great.

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<v Speaker 2>What a treat, What a treat. Thank you,