WEBVTT 1 00:00:10.880 --> 00:00:14.135 Friends, hello, and welcome to Never Post, a 2 00:00:14.135 --> 00:00:16.055 podcast for and about the Internet. I'm your host, Mike 3 00:00:16.055 --> 00:00:21.175 Rugnetta. This intro was written on Tuesday, 06/17/2025 at 4 00:00:21.175 --> 00:00:26.980 09:06AM eastern, and we have a bop for you this week. Georgia 5 00:00:26.980 --> 00:00:29.940 talks with Tim Lawrence, professor of cultural studies at 6 00:00:29.940 --> 00:00:32.900 the University of East London and author of multiple books 7 00:00:32.900 --> 00:00:38.100 about the history of dancing, DJs, and nightlife about why no 8 00:00:38.100 --> 00:00:41.685 one dances in the club anymore. I bet you can guess. 9 00:00:41.765 --> 00:00:48.085 Then the glorious return of what is going on here? Where the 10 00:00:48.085 --> 00:00:52.085 Neverpost team brings in posts to the group and asks, yes, that 11 00:00:52.085 --> 00:00:59.390 is right. What is going on here? And also sign offs. But right 12 00:00:59.390 --> 00:01:00.750 now, we're gonna take a quick break. 13 00:01:00.750 --> 00:01:02.910 You're gonna listen to some ads unless you're on the member 14 00:01:02.910 --> 00:01:05.630 feed. And when we return, we're gonna talk about a few of the 15 00:01:05.630 --> 00:01:08.270 things that have happened since the last time you heard from us. 16 00:01:09.965 --> 00:01:13.005 Give me fuel, give me fire, give me that which I desire as long 17 00:01:13.005 --> 00:01:18.845 as it's five stories this week. WhatsApp is getting ads and 18 00:01:19.245 --> 00:01:23.300 crowdfunding. While the chats tab of WhatsApp will remain 19 00:01:23.300 --> 00:01:28.100 unchanged, two new features are coming to the updates tab used 20 00:01:28.100 --> 00:01:31.460 to follow brands, local businesses, celebrities, and the 21 00:01:31.460 --> 00:01:32.740 US state department. 22 00:01:32.740 --> 00:01:35.675 Channel owners will now be able to offer subscriptions in 23 00:01:35.675 --> 00:01:39.355 exchange for exclusive content and the updates tab will now 24 00:01:39.355 --> 00:01:43.275 feature ads similar to how they appear in stream on Facebook and 25 00:01:43.275 --> 00:01:46.795 Instagram. I cannot wait to see what sorts of exclusive content 26 00:01:46.795 --> 00:01:49.915 and ad placements the State Department of the United States 27 00:01:49.915 --> 00:01:56.420 of America offers up for a few bucks a month. Disney, assuming 28 00:01:56.420 --> 00:01:59.700 mid journey, the mouse and Universal are filing suit 29 00:01:59.700 --> 00:02:02.500 against the generative AI startup claiming it trained 30 00:02:02.500 --> 00:02:06.260 models on archives of work owned by both studios. Reuters reports 31 00:02:06.260 --> 00:02:09.455 that quote, Horatio Gutierrez, Disney's executive vice 32 00:02:09.455 --> 00:02:12.575 president and chief legal officer said in a statement, we 33 00:02:12.575 --> 00:02:16.255 are bullish on the promise of AI technology and optimistic about 34 00:02:16.255 --> 00:02:20.335 how it can be used responsibly as a tool to further human 35 00:02:20.040 --> 00:02:23.400 creativity, but piracy is piracy. And the fact that it's 36 00:02:23.400 --> 00:02:27.640 done by an AI company does not make it any less infringing. 37 00:02:29.000 --> 00:02:33.365 Your Apple Watch is calling the cops while you're moshing. Last 38 00:02:33.365 --> 00:02:36.245 weekend, calls to local emergency services doubled 39 00:02:36.245 --> 00:02:39.605 during Leicestershire's annual download festival hosting bands 40 00:02:39.605 --> 00:02:43.125 like Sleep Token and Korn largely because the activities 41 00:02:43.125 --> 00:02:47.525 of attendees triggered their smart watches crash detection 42 00:02:47.525 --> 00:02:50.890 feature normally used to alert first responders to car 43 00:02:50.890 --> 00:02:54.330 collisions and serious falls. According to the Guardian, 44 00:02:54.330 --> 00:02:57.610 quote, police are asking fans to stay online if their device 45 00:02:57.610 --> 00:03:02.245 makes an accidental 999 call or to answer callbacks made by 46 00:03:02.245 --> 00:03:07.525 emergency teams to let us know you're safe. TikTok can 47 00:03:07.525 --> 00:03:10.325 influence your opinion of politicians. A new paper 48 00:03:10.325 --> 00:03:13.780 published in Social Media and Society titled Thirst Traps and 49 00:03:13.780 --> 00:03:17.700 Quick Cuts, the effects of TikTok edits on evaluations of 50 00:03:17.700 --> 00:03:22.180 politicians finds that quote, thirst trap edits cause an 51 00:03:22.180 --> 00:03:25.060 increase in perception of politician attractiveness and 52 00:03:25.060 --> 00:03:29.055 that badass edits improve overall evaluation of Donald 53 00:03:29.055 --> 00:03:31.055 Trump, but not Joe Biden. 54 00:03:32.975 --> 00:03:36.415 The study was conducted in June of last year ahead of Biden's 55 00:03:36.415 --> 00:03:39.760 exit from the presidential race. We argue, the author's right, 56 00:03:39.760 --> 00:03:42.720 that the proliferation of the technologies that make edits 57 00:03:42.720 --> 00:03:45.520 possible represents a significant shift in the 58 00:03:45.520 --> 00:03:49.440 practice of democratic politics. To date, a primary concern 59 00:03:49.440 --> 00:03:52.960 around digital media is the proliferation of misinformation. 60 00:03:53.280 --> 00:03:56.095 Although facticity is an important element of digital 61 00:03:56.095 --> 00:03:59.535 media and to democratic politics, we argue that it is 62 00:03:59.535 --> 00:04:02.975 more central to textual communication than to images or 63 00:04:02.975 --> 00:04:06.975 particularly video. We study a novel form of digital media that 64 00:04:06.975 --> 00:04:12.210 is manifestly not about facticity, end quote. 65 00:04:12.210 --> 00:04:18.770 And finally, Nexus Mods was purchased by Chosen, an 66 00:04:18.770 --> 00:04:22.145 organization that Eurogamer describes as a quote, growth 67 00:04:22.145 --> 00:04:24.945 focused gaming company. I don't know what that means, but their 68 00:04:24.945 --> 00:04:28.065 website says, we partner with founders to help scale what 69 00:04:28.065 --> 00:04:31.025 they've built, amplifying their impact, supporting their team 70 00:04:31.025 --> 00:04:34.380 and culture, and ensuring the business thrives for the long 71 00:04:34.380 --> 00:04:38.220 term. Nexus Mods, a hub for game modding resources, has been run 72 00:04:38.220 --> 00:04:42.620 by Robin Dark One Scott for more than two decades. In a statement 73 00:04:42.620 --> 00:04:45.740 on the site's mod blog, Scott writes, the strain of being 74 00:04:45.675 --> 00:04:48.715 responsible for the behemoth I created has taken its toll. The 75 00:04:48.715 --> 00:04:51.595 stress of the job has been a regular source of anxiety and 76 00:04:51.595 --> 00:04:53.115 stress related health issues. 77 00:04:53.115 --> 00:04:56.075 I realized that I have been burning out and this started to 78 00:04:56.075 --> 00:04:59.515 have an impact on my staff and nexus mods as a whole. So I 79 00:04:59.515 --> 00:05:01.730 firmly believe that the best thing for the future of Nexus 80 00:05:01.730 --> 00:05:05.410 Mods is for me to step aside and bring in new leadership to steer 81 00:05:05.410 --> 00:05:08.290 the business forward with renewed energy to make Nexus 82 00:05:08.290 --> 00:05:12.290 Mods the modding community we all truly deserve, end quote. 83 00:05:12.290 --> 00:05:15.085 Nexus members immediately began digging into the past of the new 84 00:05:15.085 --> 00:05:17.405 management only to find endorsements of both 85 00:05:17.405 --> 00:05:21.725 cryptocurrency and NFTs which the new owners have since said 86 00:05:21.725 --> 00:05:25.885 will not be forced upon the modding community. Fingers 87 00:05:26.205 --> 00:05:32.880 crossed. That is the news I have for you in this week's episode, 88 00:05:32.880 --> 00:05:39.040 Georgia on phones at the club, and then what is going on here? 89 00:05:39.040 --> 00:05:43.915 But first, did you know that there was a time in history when 90 00:05:43.915 --> 00:05:49.675 content stopped? When it turned off and it wasn't available 91 00:05:49.675 --> 00:05:54.395 anymore? In our interstitials this week, sign off messages 92 00:05:54.395 --> 00:05:59.290 from three television networks aired in the late seventies and 93 00:05:59.290 --> 00:05:59.770 eighties. 94 00:06:12.975 --> 00:06:16.815 This concludes our schedule of events for today. If 95 00:06:16.815 --> 00:06:20.495 you've missed a program or would like to see one a second time, 96 00:06:20.655 --> 00:06:23.695 feature presentations are repeated throughout the month on 97 00:06:23.695 --> 00:06:27.790 Home Box Office. Consult your program guide for exact dates 98 00:06:27.790 --> 00:06:28.670 and times. 99 00:07:33.870 --> 00:07:36.350 For the last few months, I've been following 100 00:07:36.350 --> 00:07:40.305 this online conversation around a strange phenomenon happening 101 00:07:40.625 --> 00:07:41.745 at the club. 102 00:07:42.545 --> 00:07:45.905 We went to a bar the other night, and the DJ was playing 103 00:07:46.465 --> 00:07:53.400 bops. Okay. Kesha was played, Bad Bunny, Gasolina. And me and 104 00:07:53.400 --> 00:07:57.800 my friends were the only ones dancing. You get to the club and 105 00:07:57.800 --> 00:07:58.920 you just stand up. 106 00:07:59.080 --> 00:08:01.400 Or the bar or wherever you go. Wherever you go to hang out, 107 00:08:01.400 --> 00:08:05.000 you're not dancing. Why doesn't anyone dance anymore? Hello? 108 00:08:06.075 --> 00:08:06.795 Hello? 109 00:08:06.795 --> 00:08:08.235 Why aren't you dancing? 110 00:08:10.875 --> 00:08:14.075 Across my feeds, I keep seeing videos and 111 00:08:14.075 --> 00:08:17.515 tweets and posts in which people claim that out at the club, 112 00:08:18.090 --> 00:08:22.650 nobody dances anymore. And there was often visual proof of this, 113 00:08:22.970 --> 00:08:26.730 clips where someone pans across a packed dance floor only to 114 00:08:26.730 --> 00:08:31.685 show people just standing around. As this concern started 115 00:08:31.685 --> 00:08:36.405 to swell online, the response to it came in just as quickly. 116 00:08:36.805 --> 00:08:40.565 Basically, and you'll be shocked to hear this, but it's that damn 117 00:08:40.565 --> 00:08:44.070 phone. There are too many phones out at the function and that's 118 00:08:44.070 --> 00:08:45.430 why nobody's dancing. 119 00:08:45.430 --> 00:08:49.190 You're worried about being on camera so people don't dance. 120 00:08:49.190 --> 00:08:53.670 No one wants to wake up the next day and see their face on like 121 00:08:53.670 --> 00:08:55.350 the club Instagram page. 122 00:08:55.350 --> 00:08:57.605 Why does no one wanna dance anymore? Like, nobody dances so 123 00:08:57.605 --> 00:08:58.405 boring blah blah blah. 124 00:08:58.405 --> 00:08:59.845 It's because when people do dance, 125 00:08:59.845 --> 00:09:04.325 you guys film them and put it on TikTok. Cut that shit out. 126 00:09:06.565 --> 00:09:08.805 Beyond individual people commenting on 127 00:09:08.805 --> 00:09:12.530 this, Vox also published a piece a few months ago about this 128 00:09:12.530 --> 00:09:16.130 exact same phenomenon. And they came to the same conclusion, 129 00:09:16.530 --> 00:09:19.090 that the fear of being documented and having your 130 00:09:19.090 --> 00:09:23.010 likeness shared online was a huge reason why people choose to 131 00:09:23.010 --> 00:09:27.445 just forgo the act of dancing entirely. And I mean, I get 132 00:09:27.445 --> 00:09:31.285 that. Like, the irony is not lost on me that a lot of the 133 00:09:31.285 --> 00:09:34.805 videos I saw about the lack of dancing at the club were videos 134 00:09:34.805 --> 00:09:39.045 where people were filming the other patrons at the club not 135 00:09:38.880 --> 00:09:44.720 dancing. Phones are tools of distraction in virtually every 136 00:09:44.720 --> 00:09:48.400 part of our lives, but I just wonder what it is about the act 137 00:09:48.400 --> 00:09:53.675 of dancing and publicly dancing with other people that is so 138 00:09:53.755 --> 00:09:56.155 antithetical to the presence of a smartphone. 139 00:09:58.555 --> 00:10:00.635 If the people around you are not dancing, but 140 00:10:00.635 --> 00:10:04.475 they're just talking, or they're on their phones or who knows 141 00:10:04.475 --> 00:10:08.260 what, It's not much it's kinda hard to have a good time. It's 142 00:10:08.260 --> 00:10:10.340 much easier to have a good time when everyone around you 143 00:10:10.340 --> 00:10:10.980 dancing. 144 00:10:10.980 --> 00:10:12.260 That's Tim Lawrence. 145 00:10:12.260 --> 00:10:16.580 I'm the author of three books on the history of, 146 00:10:16.820 --> 00:10:21.795 dance, music, DJ culture, and art culture in New York City in 147 00:10:21.795 --> 00:10:25.155 the nineteen seventies and early nineteen eighties. I've been 148 00:10:25.155 --> 00:10:30.835 running, two community parties that place a high emphasis on, 149 00:10:31.075 --> 00:10:34.860 good stereo sounds, and I've been doing this for twenty two 150 00:10:34.860 --> 00:10:38.300 years now. One is called Lucky Cloud Sound System. Another is 151 00:10:38.300 --> 00:10:41.660 called All Our Friends, and I'm also the cohost of a podcast 152 00:10:41.660 --> 00:10:45.100 about music, the dance floor, and counterculture called Love 153 00:10:45.100 --> 00:10:46.060 is the Message. 154 00:10:47.925 --> 00:10:50.645 Tim has spent his career writing about and 155 00:10:50.645 --> 00:10:54.085 immersing himself in club culture. He speaks about it with 156 00:10:54.085 --> 00:10:58.485 this deep reverence. And as he explained to me, the act of 157 00:10:58.485 --> 00:11:01.600 dancing in a public setting offers a kind of experience that 158 00:11:01.600 --> 00:11:04.960 just can't really be replicated anywhere else. 159 00:11:05.680 --> 00:11:08.480 If we want to, we can just dance in our rooms, by 160 00:11:08.480 --> 00:11:11.600 ourselves. That's a perfectly legitimate thing to people to 161 00:11:11.600 --> 00:11:14.975 do. But if you do it with other people, you can have much more 162 00:11:14.975 --> 00:11:17.935 of a sense of elation. And the reason the reason this happens 163 00:11:17.935 --> 00:11:20.655 is you will generally be by being with other people, you 164 00:11:20.655 --> 00:11:23.055 interact with other people, then you can have more of a pre 165 00:11:23.135 --> 00:11:26.255 appreciation of of our existence and also the way that we 166 00:11:26.255 --> 00:11:30.510 basically cohabit, we with other human beings and, of course, 167 00:11:30.510 --> 00:11:35.070 with everything that is on the planet. What can happen in these 168 00:11:35.070 --> 00:11:38.750 situations is you can come close to having a sense of the essence 169 00:11:38.750 --> 00:11:40.750 of what it might be to be human. 170 00:11:45.585 --> 00:11:48.065 Tim went on to mention that a defining feeling 171 00:11:48.065 --> 00:11:52.065 of communal dance is collective joy, a term popularized by the 172 00:11:52.065 --> 00:11:56.305 sociologist Barbara Ehrenreich in her 2006 book, Dancing in the 173 00:11:56.305 --> 00:12:00.100 Streets. In the book, she examines dance as an act that 174 00:12:00.100 --> 00:12:03.940 generates both a sense of togetherness with others, and 175 00:12:03.940 --> 00:12:08.100 also individual ecstatic pleasure. And that enjoyment 176 00:12:08.100 --> 00:12:12.045 comes in large part due to the freedom that can come from being 177 00:12:12.045 --> 00:12:16.525 a member of a collective sharing the same experience. Near the 178 00:12:16.525 --> 00:12:20.125 end of the book, Ehrenreich explains that, quote, the 179 00:12:20.125 --> 00:12:24.460 capacity for collective joy is encoded into us almost as deeply 180 00:12:24.460 --> 00:12:28.300 as the capacity for the erotic love of one human for another. 181 00:12:28.620 --> 00:12:32.460 We can live without it, as most of us do, but only at the risk 182 00:12:32.460 --> 00:12:35.740 of succumbing to the solitary nightmare of depression. 183 00:12:36.220 --> 00:12:41.655 She writes that later, quote, there is no point to it. No 184 00:12:41.655 --> 00:12:46.135 religious overtones, ideological message, or money to be made. 185 00:12:46.455 --> 00:12:49.815 Just the chance, which we need much more of on this crowded 186 00:12:49.815 --> 00:12:53.540 planet, to acknowledge the miracle of our simultaneous 187 00:12:53.540 --> 00:12:58.260 existence with some sort of celebration. To Ehren Reich, 188 00:12:58.340 --> 00:13:02.420 collective joy through public dance is just that. An excuse to 189 00:13:02.420 --> 00:13:06.165 celebrate, to express oneself freely among others who are 190 00:13:06.165 --> 00:13:07.205 doing the same. 191 00:13:07.205 --> 00:13:10.485 When people want to get into the go onto a dance 192 00:13:10.485 --> 00:13:15.765 floor and just kind of forget about their everyday challenges, 193 00:13:15.925 --> 00:13:19.380 problems, the the things that might just kind of you can't 194 00:13:19.380 --> 00:13:22.820 stop, you know, you get stuck in your mind that you just find 195 00:13:22.820 --> 00:13:29.380 kind of, are undermining your sense of of of, tranquility, 196 00:13:29.380 --> 00:13:34.660 let's say, or goodwill or happiness. You get on the dance 197 00:13:34.335 --> 00:13:36.175 floor to let all of that go. 198 00:13:37.215 --> 00:13:40.095 On the dance floor, you're not beholden to 199 00:13:40.095 --> 00:13:43.615 whatever role you hold in, quote, unquote, polite society. 200 00:13:43.935 --> 00:13:47.615 Nobody even knows your name, let alone what job you have or 201 00:13:47.615 --> 00:13:51.490 whether you have student loans or stress out about school. You 202 00:13:51.490 --> 00:13:55.410 get to be anonymous, to express yourself in a way that might be 203 00:13:55.410 --> 00:14:00.530 more, I mean, free by virtue of not needing to hold on to 204 00:14:00.225 --> 00:14:03.585 various components of your regular life. What's better, 205 00:14:03.825 --> 00:14:06.545 everyone around you is experiencing this feeling 206 00:14:06.545 --> 00:14:11.665 together, and that feels good, validating, comforting. It's a 207 00:14:11.665 --> 00:14:14.690 reminder that whatever baggage you left at the door of the club 208 00:14:14.850 --> 00:14:20.130 doesn't define every moment of your life, that this can also be 209 00:14:20.130 --> 00:14:21.810 part of your expression too. 210 00:14:22.450 --> 00:14:27.170 An expression in this space is collective and individual with 211 00:14:27.170 --> 00:14:31.065 both feeding on each other. The energy exuberance of the crowd 212 00:14:31.065 --> 00:14:35.065 is added to by your own form of self expression, by your own 213 00:14:35.065 --> 00:14:39.625 body dancing amidst all the other bodies. It's this perfect 214 00:14:39.705 --> 00:14:46.640 little circuit that is until the phones come in. So I said to 215 00:14:46.640 --> 00:14:50.240 Tim, can you fully express yourself on the dance floor if 216 00:14:50.240 --> 00:14:51.520 you know there's cameras? 217 00:14:52.560 --> 00:14:56.560 Well, I certainly wouldn't be able to. The phone 218 00:14:56.560 --> 00:15:00.925 on some level is always going to disrupt. It's gonna take you 219 00:15:00.925 --> 00:15:03.725 away from being in that moment. But the the other thing about 220 00:15:03.725 --> 00:15:06.925 the phone is that it then takes you it affects everyone around 221 00:15:06.925 --> 00:15:10.365 you. So if someone is by you and they're on the phone, they're 222 00:15:10.365 --> 00:15:13.325 kind of you know, not only are they not there, but they're not 223 00:15:12.780 --> 00:15:16.060 contributing to the, you know, this dynamism of the party. 224 00:15:16.060 --> 00:15:18.940 It's all these bodies kind of, you know, in this kinetic motion 225 00:15:18.940 --> 00:15:22.700 that can beautifully kind of connect together. It's a 226 00:15:22.700 --> 00:15:24.380 circuit, and they interrupt the circuit. 227 00:15:34.555 --> 00:15:37.035 To better understand this, we need to dig 228 00:15:37.035 --> 00:15:41.210 deeper into this notion of the crowd. Specifically, the 229 00:15:41.210 --> 00:15:46.090 difference between a crowd and an audience. Barbara Ehrenreich 230 00:15:46.090 --> 00:15:49.690 has an entire chapter of her book dedicated to what she calls 231 00:15:49.690 --> 00:15:54.545 the revolt of the audience. She writes that, quote, the great 232 00:15:54.545 --> 00:15:58.785 innovation of the modern era has been the replacement of older, 233 00:15:58.785 --> 00:16:02.945 more participatory forms of festivity with spectacles in 234 00:16:02.945 --> 00:16:08.050 which the crowd serves merely as an audience, unquote. An 235 00:16:08.050 --> 00:16:13.090 audience is expected to observe, to enjoy perhaps, but not to 236 00:16:13.090 --> 00:16:13.890 participate. 237 00:16:14.370 --> 00:16:18.050 As a member of the audience, you can clap, you can sing along, 238 00:16:18.050 --> 00:16:22.415 hell, you can even dance, but you are not the event. An 239 00:16:22.415 --> 00:16:26.495 audience demands the presence of a spectacle, of a single point 240 00:16:26.495 --> 00:16:30.975 of focus that everyone is there to observe. But the dance floor 241 00:16:31.135 --> 00:16:33.215 isn't meant to be like that. 242 00:16:33.295 --> 00:16:37.810 The dance floor is is most expressive, most 243 00:16:37.810 --> 00:16:42.210 dynamic, most engaging when people are dancing with each 244 00:16:42.210 --> 00:16:46.370 other rather than looking at the DJ. If the crowd starts to look 245 00:16:46.370 --> 00:16:49.730 at the DJ, then you're just entering into a, let's say, a 246 00:16:49.730 --> 00:16:54.295 rock concert scenario, hero worship, etcetera, which is like 247 00:16:54.295 --> 00:16:57.735 chur. Everyone's facing the priest. Whereas actually, what 248 00:16:57.735 --> 00:17:01.495 we want is conversation, democracy, interaction, 249 00:17:01.655 --> 00:17:05.095 antiphony, call and response, whatever words we wanna give it. 250 00:17:05.250 --> 00:17:09.170 To me, the the dance is the audience, if you like. 251 00:17:09.170 --> 00:17:12.290 This doesn't have to be a leader figure here. It's about 252 00:17:12.290 --> 00:17:16.130 interacting with those immediately around you and and 253 00:17:16.130 --> 00:17:19.885 feeling this sense of kind of collective energy come through 254 00:17:19.885 --> 00:17:23.165 that, and it's and that surpasses your yourself as a 255 00:17:23.165 --> 00:17:24.045 individual. 256 00:17:24.285 --> 00:17:26.685 When an errant phone camera appears on the 257 00:17:26.685 --> 00:17:31.245 dance floor, that structure falls apart. Using your phone is 258 00:17:31.245 --> 00:17:36.110 an inherently individual act, and as such, it severs you from 259 00:17:36.110 --> 00:17:40.270 the communal joy of group dancing. And sure, posting about 260 00:17:40.270 --> 00:17:45.950 it may bring you joy, but it's a kind of extractive joy. Through 261 00:17:45.950 --> 00:17:48.365 the phone, the sense of enjoyment you receive from 262 00:17:48.365 --> 00:17:51.565 sharing a video and getting likes or comments on it serves 263 00:17:51.565 --> 00:17:56.685 more as a commodity than a lived, embodied experience. It's 264 00:17:56.685 --> 00:17:58.285 a copy of the real thing. 265 00:17:58.605 --> 00:18:02.540 And don't get me wrong, that can still feel nice. But the simple 266 00:18:02.540 --> 00:18:07.020 act of pulling out your phone to record the DJ or yourself or, 267 00:18:07.020 --> 00:18:11.660 God forbid, a stranger on the dance floor, instantly destroys 268 00:18:11.660 --> 00:18:15.895 your role as a member of the crowd, of the collective, and 269 00:18:15.895 --> 00:18:20.055 turns you into the maker of a spectacle. Your audience, in 270 00:18:20.055 --> 00:18:24.135 this case, isn't anyone in the room with you. It's your 271 00:18:24.135 --> 00:18:26.775 followers. It's strangers online. 272 00:18:31.470 --> 00:18:33.470 Something that says, we're gonna capture this 273 00:18:33.470 --> 00:18:35.950 moment and we're gonna, like, take it we're gonna take it 274 00:18:35.950 --> 00:18:39.150 outside of this environment because it's gonna preserve it. 275 00:18:39.470 --> 00:18:44.285 And then that can go online. It can be shown to other people. So 276 00:18:44.285 --> 00:18:47.165 on some level, it's a it's a possible breach of privacy, 277 00:18:47.165 --> 00:18:50.525 let's say. It's a possible breach of kind of intimacy. 278 00:18:50.685 --> 00:18:53.965 It threatens or it physically does kinda say, okay. This is 279 00:18:54.205 --> 00:18:56.525 this this moment doesn't have its own integrity. 280 00:18:57.165 --> 00:18:59.820 In a lot of clubs, the reaction to the 281 00:18:59.820 --> 00:19:03.020 problem of phones on the dance floor is to flat out ban them 282 00:19:03.020 --> 00:19:06.860 entirely. In the time I've been doing research for this segment, 283 00:19:06.940 --> 00:19:10.780 several clubs have opened that make a point to say that cell 284 00:19:10.780 --> 00:19:15.175 phones are not welcome inside. The parties that Tim throws have 285 00:19:15.175 --> 00:19:16.615 no phone policies too. 286 00:19:16.615 --> 00:19:19.815 People think it's a human right to be able to use 287 00:19:19.815 --> 00:19:23.415 your phone, one's phone. It's incredible. It's almost like 288 00:19:23.415 --> 00:19:26.215 sometimes the most offensive thing you can possibly say to 289 00:19:26.215 --> 00:19:28.455 someone is, do you mind not using your phone? Even though 290 00:19:28.455 --> 00:19:31.590 we've asked this numerous times over. It's like, oh, I just want 291 00:19:31.590 --> 00:19:34.550 to tell my friend where I am or oh, there's this reason or oh, 292 00:19:34.550 --> 00:19:36.550 there's that reason or oh, there's that reason. 293 00:19:36.790 --> 00:19:40.070 And it's always about like, well, it's it's okay for me, but 294 00:19:40.550 --> 00:19:45.815 but just not anyone else. But my my it's this is this is this is 295 00:19:45.815 --> 00:19:49.735 why I'm special, basically. And look. I I don't it's not 296 00:19:49.735 --> 00:19:53.175 serious. This is again, I don't want to take any of this too 297 00:19:53.175 --> 00:19:53.895 seriously. 298 00:19:54.135 --> 00:19:57.175 But what we what I do know and what the people I work with know 299 00:19:57.175 --> 00:20:01.490 is that it's much nicer. It's incomparable to have a a dance 300 00:20:01.490 --> 00:20:06.370 floor without phones than than, you know, a dance floor where 301 00:20:06.370 --> 00:20:07.650 everyone's on the phone. 302 00:20:08.850 --> 00:20:11.890 Establishing a no phones policy interrupts that 303 00:20:11.890 --> 00:20:15.565 entitlement that Tim is talking about. An entitlement really is 304 00:20:15.565 --> 00:20:18.845 what it feels like here. Not just feeling entitled to 305 00:20:18.845 --> 00:20:22.845 checking your phone wherever you are, but to use it to document 306 00:20:22.845 --> 00:20:26.125 whatever's going on around you with little consideration of the 307 00:20:26.125 --> 00:20:31.520 impact that act has on the space you are physically embodying. 308 00:20:32.000 --> 00:20:37.040 It's the entitlement of creating a spectacle. So if you remove 309 00:20:37.040 --> 00:20:40.480 the sheer possibility of taking a video or posting a photo at 310 00:20:40.480 --> 00:20:44.965 the club, you deny the ability to create a spectacle and court 311 00:20:44.965 --> 00:20:45.845 an audience. 312 00:20:46.405 --> 00:20:49.685 You're also forced to focus your energy on the physical space 313 00:20:49.685 --> 00:20:53.365 that you're in. You have to remain in the real world 314 00:20:53.365 --> 00:20:56.950 environment of the dance floor without the possibility of 315 00:20:56.950 --> 00:21:01.350 recontextualizing it somewhere else. It makes me think of what 316 00:21:01.350 --> 00:21:04.790 Tim said earlier, how people come to dance in order to leave 317 00:21:04.790 --> 00:21:08.245 the stresses of their lives aside, Of what Barbara 318 00:21:08.245 --> 00:21:12.245 Ehrenreich wrote about how the ecstasy of communal dance comes 319 00:21:12.245 --> 00:21:16.565 with a shedding of the mask one has to put on in polite society. 320 00:21:17.205 --> 00:21:21.525 The no phone policy at the club suggests to me that part of that 321 00:21:21.525 --> 00:21:26.380 real world baggage is your phone. And there is a way that 322 00:21:26.380 --> 00:21:30.540 the phone does adhere itself to a kind of role that we are all 323 00:21:30.540 --> 00:21:33.500 expected to play for ourselves and for each other. 324 00:21:33.980 --> 00:21:37.945 Maybe it's being a poster, or a passive scroller, or a live 325 00:21:37.945 --> 00:21:41.145 streamer. But whatever it is, your relationship with the 326 00:21:41.145 --> 00:21:46.105 social Internet is a kind of performance that you do, so long 327 00:21:46.105 --> 00:21:52.380 as you have your phone in your hand. I do think that there is a 328 00:21:52.380 --> 00:21:55.180 degree of communal enjoyment that can come from posting 329 00:21:55.180 --> 00:21:59.420 online. It's a very accessible way of being seen, of sharing an 330 00:21:59.420 --> 00:22:04.075 experience, even if it's just through a screen. But it is just 331 00:22:04.075 --> 00:22:05.435 through a screen. 332 00:22:05.755 --> 00:22:09.755 It's a kind of togetherness that is inherently limited. It's 333 00:22:09.755 --> 00:22:16.155 flat. And as Tim said to me, it often doesn't really endure. 334 00:22:17.430 --> 00:22:20.950 It's perfectly possible that some people, so 335 00:22:20.950 --> 00:22:26.390 enjoy being visible to others, being seen. Let's say being seen 336 00:22:26.390 --> 00:22:30.475 gives them the sense a sense of existing in the first place If 337 00:22:30.475 --> 00:22:33.675 they're not being kind of on some sort of screen, if they're 338 00:22:33.675 --> 00:22:37.995 not being watched and maybe admired, then they don't really 339 00:22:37.995 --> 00:22:42.475 exist, then maybe this group of people can can only express 340 00:22:42.475 --> 00:22:58.020 themselves fully when they're being watched. My belief is that 341 00:22:56.805 --> 00:22:59.765 this kind of this thrill the thrill that might come with the 342 00:22:59.765 --> 00:23:05.205 idea that you have an audience is inherently, ephemeral. It's 343 00:23:05.205 --> 00:23:08.085 meaningless. There's something addictive about it, you know, 344 00:23:08.085 --> 00:23:10.725 and it's the reason it's addictive is that it doesn't it 345 00:23:10.725 --> 00:23:12.460 doesn't doesn't it's not a lasting feeling. 346 00:23:12.460 --> 00:23:17.180 So you kind of have to kind of keep on being seen. Keep on 347 00:23:17.180 --> 00:23:17.900 being 348 00:23:26.715 --> 00:23:29.035 interesting to me that Tim mentions the idea of 349 00:23:29.035 --> 00:23:34.075 ephemerality here. Because in a way, what's more transient, more 350 00:23:34.075 --> 00:23:38.075 temporary than a night out at the club? You'll never dance the 351 00:23:38.075 --> 00:23:41.870 exact same way twice. You'll never get to identically repeat 352 00:23:41.870 --> 00:23:45.550 the experience from one night to the next. Dancing is 353 00:23:45.550 --> 00:23:49.710 intrinsically temporal, an endless series of motions that 354 00:23:49.710 --> 00:23:52.350 disappear and are replaced with new ones. 355 00:23:52.990 --> 00:23:57.015 And to that point, a video or a photo of that night has more 356 00:23:57.015 --> 00:24:00.055 staying power. If you post a video of your friend death 357 00:24:00.055 --> 00:24:03.255 dropping on the dance floor, your Instagram followers can see 358 00:24:03.255 --> 00:24:07.335 it. You can rewatch it, and it exists for much longer than the 359 00:24:07.335 --> 00:24:10.360 experience of seeing it in real life. But I think the true 360 00:24:10.360 --> 00:24:14.360 staying power when it comes to collective joy is in the act of 361 00:24:14.360 --> 00:24:20.440 embodied participation. Of truly being a member of a crowd, all 362 00:24:20.440 --> 00:24:24.355 dancing and sweating together for no other reason than for the 363 00:24:24.355 --> 00:24:26.035 enjoyment of the experience. 364 00:24:26.755 --> 00:24:30.355 The phone can attract your attention. It can demand your 365 00:24:30.355 --> 00:24:34.355 participation. A phone is a great tool for documentation, 366 00:24:34.755 --> 00:24:39.540 for visual evidence of a wild night out, but it will never be 367 00:24:39.620 --> 00:24:40.420 embodied. 368 00:24:40.820 --> 00:24:44.740 There is no video in the history of the planet 369 00:24:44.980 --> 00:24:49.780 that has been able to remotely capture what is going on on that 370 00:24:49.780 --> 00:24:54.265 dance floor, not remotely. We might give ourselves the 371 00:24:54.265 --> 00:24:56.825 impression that it does, but if we think about it, it's that it 372 00:24:56.825 --> 00:24:58.025 can't even come close. 373 00:25:10.890 --> 00:25:13.130 An immense thank you to Tim Lawrence for 374 00:25:13.130 --> 00:25:16.810 sharing his thoughts and experiences on dance, club 375 00:25:16.810 --> 00:25:20.330 culture, and collective joy. To find more of his work, you can 376 00:25:20.330 --> 00:25:23.625 find him at timlawrence.com. And if you'd like to learn more 377 00:25:23.625 --> 00:25:27.465 about the parties he runs or even attend them yourself, you 378 00:25:27.465 --> 00:25:31.385 can find information at luckycloudsystems.com and 379 00:25:31.385 --> 00:25:34.585 allourfriends.com. I'll include links for all of that in the 380 00:25:34.585 --> 00:25:37.450 show notes. And I'm interested to hear your thoughts about 381 00:25:37.450 --> 00:25:38.650 phones at the club. 382 00:25:38.970 --> 00:25:42.890 Do you take videos on the dance floor? Does the threat of being 383 00:25:42.890 --> 00:25:47.770 documented affect how or if you dance publicly? How do you feel 384 00:25:47.770 --> 00:25:51.355 about the no phone policy? I mean, should it be implemented 385 00:25:51.355 --> 00:25:55.515 elsewhere, like at the gym, at the grocery store, everywhere? 386 00:25:56.155 --> 00:25:59.435 All the information on how to reach us is also in the show 387 00:25:59.435 --> 00:26:00.075 notes. 388 00:26:02.395 --> 00:26:05.450 Channel six in Sacramento, California. Channel 389 00:26:05.450 --> 00:26:08.890 six is owned and operated by nonprofit Central California 390 00:26:08.890 --> 00:26:12.730 Educational Television. The KVIE studios are located on the 391 00:26:12.730 --> 00:26:16.170 Garden Highway in Sacramento. The transmitter is located at 392 00:26:16.170 --> 00:26:19.850 Walnut Grove, California and operates at maximum power on 393 00:26:19.850 --> 00:26:23.475 channel six. Sound and picture are relayed to Walnut Grove by 394 00:26:23.475 --> 00:26:26.275 microwave station KMZ sixty. 395 00:26:26.435 --> 00:26:29.315 Portions of KVIE's daily programming are on film and 396 00:26:29.315 --> 00:26:33.315 videotape. This concludes our broadcast for today. The staff 397 00:26:33.315 --> 00:26:35.795 of channel six wishes you a pleasant good night. 398 00:28:28.245 --> 00:28:31.125 Friends, hello, theydies and gentle thems. 399 00:28:31.125 --> 00:28:34.965 Welcome to what is going on here? A segment wherein members 400 00:28:34.965 --> 00:28:38.150 of the Neverpost staff bring a posts to the group about which 401 00:28:38.150 --> 00:28:43.750 they would like to ask. What is going on here? What? 402 00:28:50.415 --> 00:28:52.975 Could we have done some googling? Could we have gone 403 00:28:52.975 --> 00:28:55.775 further down thread? Could we have cracked a book or gone to 404 00:28:55.775 --> 00:28:59.535 YouTube? Probably. But where is the fun in that? 405 00:28:59.535 --> 00:29:01.695 In the following segment, we share things that we found 406 00:29:01.695 --> 00:29:05.455 online that made us want to know more and about which we thought 407 00:29:04.710 --> 00:29:09.190 the process of finding out more would be fun to do together. 408 00:29:09.590 --> 00:29:12.790 Joining us this round in order of how likely I think it is that 409 00:29:12.790 --> 00:29:18.175 they are descended from an Arcturian starseed are Never 410 00:29:18.175 --> 00:29:21.535 post executive producer Jason Oberholtzer. Are we ascending or 411 00:29:21.535 --> 00:29:24.335 descending? This is ascending. So Jason, I think you're 412 00:29:24.335 --> 00:29:25.375 probably just a human. 413 00:29:25.455 --> 00:29:28.095 What gives it away? The depth behind my eyes. 414 00:29:29.855 --> 00:29:31.615 Never post producer Georgia Hampton. 415 00:29:32.050 --> 00:29:34.050 Oh, thank God. I'm just glad I'm not the top 416 00:29:34.050 --> 00:29:34.690 one. 417 00:29:34.770 --> 00:29:37.010 Never post senior producer Hans Buteau already has 418 00:29:37.010 --> 00:29:37.810 the haircut. 419 00:29:38.850 --> 00:29:41.730 Your emotions might be telling you that you 420 00:29:42.050 --> 00:29:43.010 Hans, no. 421 00:29:42.850 --> 00:29:44.130 Know things about technology. 422 00:29:45.785 --> 00:29:47.625 Go towards you are the light. 423 00:29:47.625 --> 00:29:51.305 I am the light. It's reflecting off of my head. 424 00:29:53.385 --> 00:29:56.345 Alright. Let's find out what is going on here. 425 00:29:56.425 --> 00:29:56.985 Welcome 426 00:29:56.985 --> 00:29:58.265 to today's game. 427 00:29:59.280 --> 00:30:03.200 Okay. I'm gonna send you three posts from 428 00:30:03.200 --> 00:30:08.000 Instagram, and I want you to look at them in order. Hans, I'm 429 00:30:08.000 --> 00:30:12.080 gonna have you I'm gonna have you start with, the aptly titled 430 00:30:12.080 --> 00:30:13.605 post number one. 431 00:30:13.605 --> 00:30:14.325 Post number one. 432 00:30:14.325 --> 00:30:15.525 And tell me what you see. 433 00:30:15.525 --> 00:30:18.405 I'm opening up Instagram. The dress is gold. 434 00:30:18.485 --> 00:30:20.805 Mhmm. It's from Ibiza. Ibiza. 435 00:30:21.445 --> 00:30:22.005 I 436 00:30:22.405 --> 00:30:22.885 hate that. 437 00:30:22.885 --> 00:30:27.970 A woman twirling in a satin ish Yes. Skirt and top 438 00:30:27.970 --> 00:30:31.650 combo on the sand in front of an Ibiza sunset. 439 00:30:32.450 --> 00:30:33.170 Still hate that. 440 00:30:33.170 --> 00:30:34.530 Do you do you have to say it like you're on 441 00:30:34.530 --> 00:30:35.330 Love Island? 442 00:30:35.330 --> 00:30:36.370 I was gonna say On 443 00:30:36.370 --> 00:30:40.385 paper, this is my ideal. You mugging me off? 444 00:30:40.945 --> 00:30:42.945 Okay, Hans. Go to post number two, please. 445 00:30:42.945 --> 00:30:45.825 Post number two is opening. Post number two. It 446 00:30:45.825 --> 00:30:47.745 might be the same woman. It's hard to tell because now she's 447 00:30:47.745 --> 00:30:49.185 facing the camera. It is. 448 00:30:49.185 --> 00:30:53.310 Posing video. White this time instead of gold. She's wearing 449 00:30:53.310 --> 00:30:58.990 shorts and what looks like an a very woolly angora sweater, that 450 00:30:58.990 --> 00:31:04.590 is collared. Sunglasses, doing a selfie of herself in an elevator 451 00:31:04.590 --> 00:31:06.110 holding a coach bag. 452 00:31:06.715 --> 00:31:09.355 Okay. And now post number three, please, and I 453 00:31:09.355 --> 00:31:11.195 want you to read the caption. 454 00:31:11.515 --> 00:31:15.115 Post number three, the caption says, we're thrilled 455 00:31:15.115 --> 00:31:19.195 to announce our new AI enhanced team member, Reem. Oh, no. Yes. 456 00:31:19.560 --> 00:31:21.720 I was getting the vibes. 457 00:31:21.720 --> 00:31:23.720 Yeah. Yeah. The vibes were strong. 458 00:31:23.960 --> 00:31:26.200 Who has joined the team as a fashion who has joined 459 00:31:26.200 --> 00:31:31.240 the team joined the team as a fashion and lifestyle editor. 460 00:31:31.240 --> 00:31:34.705 Swipe right for her dump of For her dump 461 00:31:34.705 --> 00:31:36.305 of the Guys. 462 00:31:38.625 --> 00:31:40.465 Oh, you nailed it, Lord. 463 00:31:40.625 --> 00:31:44.625 Who copy edited this? You're probably the AI 464 00:31:44.625 --> 00:31:46.510 editor. Oh, 465 00:31:46.990 --> 00:31:50.750 dump of the day. Good god. 466 00:31:50.750 --> 00:31:54.030 Swipe right for her dump of day one in SL office. I 467 00:31:54.030 --> 00:31:55.950 don't so this is from Sheerluxe? 468 00:31:55.950 --> 00:32:00.750 Yes. Sheerluxe is a UK fashion publication, a 469 00:32:00.750 --> 00:32:03.775 la, you know, Vogue, Cosmo, stuff like that. 470 00:32:03.775 --> 00:32:05.615 Okay. So you were right to say Ibiza. 471 00:32:05.935 --> 00:32:07.535 Yes. Actually, I really were. 472 00:32:07.535 --> 00:32:08.495 I could sense it. 473 00:32:08.655 --> 00:32:11.775 So yeah. Reem, all the posts that I had you 474 00:32:11.775 --> 00:32:17.720 look at are, like, her doing influencer things, like telling 475 00:32:17.720 --> 00:32:22.840 you what outfit she was wearing, being in Ibiza, but she's not 476 00:32:22.840 --> 00:32:23.400 real. 477 00:32:23.400 --> 00:32:25.160 And also that which means the clothes that she's 478 00:32:25.160 --> 00:32:26.360 wearing are not real. 479 00:32:26.360 --> 00:32:29.645 I don't know who likes this. Yeah. Like, who 480 00:32:29.645 --> 00:32:30.605 is this for? 481 00:32:30.765 --> 00:32:33.245 Who is this for? This is for an executive 482 00:32:33.245 --> 00:32:36.765 who feels like they will be accused of falling behind if 483 00:32:36.765 --> 00:32:38.925 they don't integrate AI into what they're doing. 484 00:32:38.925 --> 00:32:41.085 I think that's exactly right. That's a great 485 00:32:41.085 --> 00:32:45.890 answer. God. That's I think I think, Georgia, your response is 486 00:32:45.890 --> 00:32:47.490 exactly right. Yeah. 487 00:32:49.570 --> 00:32:52.850 So like, I'm looking at I'm looking at one of the images on 488 00:32:52.850 --> 00:32:59.115 ReemBot's grid, and it's her on a street holding a matcha latte 489 00:32:59.115 --> 00:33:01.995 and a bag that is roughly the same color as the matcha latte 490 00:33:01.995 --> 00:33:05.275 and wearing sunglasses and big gold earrings and a gold 491 00:33:05.995 --> 00:33:08.715 bracelet. And then you go to the next image in the carousel and 492 00:33:08.715 --> 00:33:11.880 she's gone. It's a bench somewhere else with a then a 493 00:33:11.880 --> 00:33:15.880 picture of the purse and the matcha latte with like a more of 494 00:33:15.880 --> 00:33:19.800 a gradient look to it. And then the third is the shoes, the 495 00:33:19.800 --> 00:33:23.800 bracelet, and the earrings, all of which also look AI generated. 496 00:33:24.215 --> 00:33:25.175 Interesting. 497 00:33:25.175 --> 00:33:26.935 So that I mean, like, yeah. I guess my question 498 00:33:26.935 --> 00:33:30.135 is like, what okay. What are we advertising here? 499 00:33:30.135 --> 00:33:31.815 Well, this is exactly it. 500 00:33:31.815 --> 00:33:34.055 Right? I'm like, I think Jason, you're 501 00:33:34.055 --> 00:33:37.350 completely right that this is basically like for shareholders, 502 00:33:37.350 --> 00:33:40.870 for for people in the c suite who feel like they have to adopt 503 00:33:40.870 --> 00:33:45.270 AI, but it is still kind of doing nothing. 504 00:33:45.670 --> 00:33:48.710 Don't know. Which I think is is exposed more 505 00:33:48.710 --> 00:33:53.085 because the objects that don't need to be generated are. Like 506 00:33:53.085 --> 00:33:56.445 you could pitch the idea for having an AI spokesperson as 507 00:33:56.445 --> 00:33:59.165 like novel and fun and potentially engaging in a way 508 00:33:59.165 --> 00:34:03.245 that would get attention from niche independent podcasters. 509 00:34:04.460 --> 00:34:08.940 And like have that character talk about items or pop into the 510 00:34:08.940 --> 00:34:12.300 universe and exist with items and then show a real item that a 511 00:34:12.300 --> 00:34:15.980 human could buy, rather than in frames absent this character 512 00:34:15.980 --> 00:34:18.140 have AI generated objects. 513 00:34:18.485 --> 00:34:21.605 And then, like, further down the grid, there are 514 00:34:21.925 --> 00:34:26.405 image carousels where it's like, almost like a a a photo collage 515 00:34:26.405 --> 00:34:30.885 of images from fashion catalogs of like I'm looking at one of 516 00:34:30.885 --> 00:34:34.330 purses. Yeah. And it is a it is literally a photo collage of 517 00:34:34.330 --> 00:34:39.450 purses from catalogs, enumerated like one by one with who made 518 00:34:39.450 --> 00:34:43.210 them and what the product is called. But then there's just an 519 00:34:43.210 --> 00:34:46.810 inset oval photo of the AI generated model. 520 00:34:47.215 --> 00:34:48.255 Yep. Yeah. 521 00:34:48.335 --> 00:34:50.655 And she's like, I collected these so that you 522 00:34:50.655 --> 00:34:52.815 could see them all in one place. You're like, okay. 523 00:34:53.695 --> 00:34:58.255 Guess like, but we know you didn't do that. It's 524 00:34:58.255 --> 00:35:00.575 part of her dump of the day, Mike. Yeah. 525 00:35:04.660 --> 00:35:08.100 And that is what's going on here. Yep. 526 00:35:11.380 --> 00:35:14.740 I have discovered a subreddit. And I 527 00:35:14.740 --> 00:35:19.435 would like to know what is going on here. Mike, would you be so 528 00:35:19.435 --> 00:35:24.635 kind as to describe what what happens to you as you join this 529 00:35:24.635 --> 00:35:25.195 subreddit? 530 00:35:25.195 --> 00:35:26.315 Yeah. What? Okay. 531 00:35:27.115 --> 00:35:29.035 It's hard to figure out where to put the eyes 532 00:35:29.035 --> 00:35:29.355 first. 533 00:35:29.355 --> 00:35:33.675 That's true. Yeah. Hold on. I gotta lie down. 534 00:35:35.150 --> 00:35:35.550 Okay. 535 00:35:35.550 --> 00:35:35.950 So we're 536 00:35:35.950 --> 00:35:39.230 at we're at our fifth world picks. This was 537 00:35:39.230 --> 00:35:45.310 created 10/07/2011. It's got 91,000 members, and it is in the 538 00:35:45.310 --> 00:35:52.005 top 2% of subs by size. The rules of the sub are submissions 539 00:35:52.005 --> 00:35:55.445 must be fifth worldly. Submissions must have clear and 540 00:35:55.445 --> 00:35:56.565 concise imagery. 541 00:35:56.725 --> 00:36:02.325 Post quality content be nice. We can see what I can only kind of 542 00:36:02.325 --> 00:36:11.810 maybe describe as like, if you did a blender adaptation of an 543 00:36:11.810 --> 00:36:14.130 MC Escher painting Yes. 544 00:36:14.370 --> 00:36:14.610 Mhmm. 545 00:36:14.610 --> 00:36:18.785 But like elaborated on it 10 times and 546 00:36:18.785 --> 00:36:23.905 then used the color scheme of the old school Windows 547 00:36:23.905 --> 00:36:26.385 screensaver that was the pipes. Yes. 548 00:36:26.465 --> 00:36:27.105 My lord. Wow. 549 00:36:27.105 --> 00:36:27.825 That's such 550 00:36:27.825 --> 00:36:28.545 a good description. 551 00:36:28.545 --> 00:36:30.705 Nailed it exactly. Holy moly. 552 00:36:30.890 --> 00:36:33.130 What you're picturing to your audience? Yep. 553 00:36:33.210 --> 00:36:34.330 It's exactly that. 554 00:36:34.330 --> 00:36:35.130 It's that. 555 00:36:35.450 --> 00:36:39.050 And then the one below it is like, it's sort of 556 00:36:39.050 --> 00:36:45.370 like you're looking down into a square well that has a similar 557 00:36:46.105 --> 00:36:49.305 color scheme to it, maybe a little bit more orange. But the 558 00:36:49.305 --> 00:36:53.305 vibe is no longer M. C. Escher. It's more like traditional South 559 00:36:53.305 --> 00:36:54.505 American art. 560 00:36:54.585 --> 00:36:55.225 Yes. 561 00:36:55.625 --> 00:36:59.030 The one after that is like a strange Janice 562 00:36:59.030 --> 00:37:01.270 faced sculpture of some kind. 563 00:37:01.270 --> 00:37:02.550 This is when the genre sort 564 00:37:02.550 --> 00:37:03.430 of Right? 565 00:37:03.430 --> 00:37:05.830 Yeah. Yeah. The genre really takes a turn here. 566 00:37:05.830 --> 00:37:07.830 Floating mug in the sky. 567 00:37:07.910 --> 00:37:10.630 I was gonna point that one out because the 568 00:37:10.630 --> 00:37:12.855 caption is just addiction. 569 00:37:12.855 --> 00:37:15.415 Addiction. Right? Mike, I'd like you to do 570 00:37:15.415 --> 00:37:17.975 me a favor. Yeah. I'd like you go to top. 571 00:37:18.055 --> 00:37:21.175 Yeah. And then I'd like you to go all time. And then I'd like 572 00:37:21.175 --> 00:37:21.655 you to talk. 573 00:37:24.910 --> 00:37:25.630 My god. 574 00:37:25.710 --> 00:37:26.270 Babe, you better 575 00:37:26.270 --> 00:37:26.910 talk fast 576 00:37:26.910 --> 00:37:28.270 because it is challenging. 577 00:37:28.270 --> 00:37:29.870 What is happening? 578 00:37:29.870 --> 00:37:32.430 It's much longer than I thought it was gonna be. 579 00:37:32.430 --> 00:37:36.510 Okay. So nine nine years ago, someone posted what is obviously 580 00:37:36.510 --> 00:37:37.870 the best post on this. 581 00:37:39.735 --> 00:37:42.935 We should have just ended here like as a as a 582 00:37:42.935 --> 00:37:43.495 society. Yeah. 583 00:37:45.575 --> 00:37:49.015 This is a video. It's a GIF actually. So there's 584 00:37:49.015 --> 00:37:55.570 no sound. There's what looks like a Rottweiler maybe riding a 585 00:37:55.570 --> 00:37:59.010 three d man shape in like nineteen nineties, early two 586 00:37:59.010 --> 00:38:00.690 thousand style three d rendering. 587 00:38:00.770 --> 00:38:01.250 Sure. 588 00:38:01.250 --> 00:38:04.370 So a Rottweiler riding a man shape down what 589 00:38:04.370 --> 00:38:08.675 looks at first like a mountain, but turns out to be the chest of 590 00:38:08.675 --> 00:38:12.115 a statue bent over backwards. 591 00:38:13.235 --> 00:38:13.635 Yes. 592 00:38:13.635 --> 00:38:18.195 So the they ride the chest down to the throat off 593 00:38:18.195 --> 00:38:21.635 the chin and as they ride off the chin, the eyes open and the 594 00:38:21.635 --> 00:38:25.720 tongue extends and then they get swallowed? No. They sort of No. 595 00:38:25.720 --> 00:38:28.600 Jump off like a sick skateboard jump. 596 00:38:28.680 --> 00:38:31.160 There's sort of a metal creature man. 597 00:38:31.160 --> 00:38:32.920 It's like a huge I'm gonna 598 00:38:32.920 --> 00:38:34.600 go ahead and I'm just gonna stop there and I'm 599 00:38:34.600 --> 00:38:36.935 not gonna describe the rest of it. There's a snowy owl, there's 600 00:38:36.935 --> 00:38:40.615 a I was gonna say gotta mention the snowy owl. This defeats 601 00:38:40.615 --> 00:38:46.855 language. I also I mean, maybe it's because this attitude has 602 00:38:46.855 --> 00:38:51.450 been cemented more since then. This feels less fifth world y to 603 00:38:51.450 --> 00:38:52.650 me than Mhmm. 604 00:38:52.650 --> 00:38:57.370 The group of images that we saw sorted by most recent. 605 00:38:57.450 --> 00:39:00.010 Is fifth world y something that you understand, 606 00:39:00.010 --> 00:39:01.050 Mike? No. Know what that is. 607 00:39:01.050 --> 00:39:01.210 And not 608 00:39:01.210 --> 00:39:03.835 outside of this. I would say that this is like, 609 00:39:03.835 --> 00:39:05.755 this is one of those places on the internet where like the 610 00:39:05.755 --> 00:39:11.035 whole purpose is to just sort of like divine and solidify this 611 00:39:11.035 --> 00:39:15.035 vibe. Yeah. And there's sort of no other purpose than to be 612 00:39:15.035 --> 00:39:18.890 like, to vibe navigate, you know, like Mhmm. To just try to 613 00:39:18.890 --> 00:39:23.770 find or make things that seem to cohere in a way that is really 614 00:39:23.770 --> 00:39:25.130 hard to describe. 615 00:39:25.610 --> 00:39:28.090 But when you see it, you're like, oh, yeah, that is fifth 616 00:39:28.090 --> 00:39:28.410 worldly. 617 00:39:28.595 --> 00:39:30.915 In the rules, it defines submissions must be 618 00:39:30.915 --> 00:39:33.875 fifth worldly if you expand it out. Oh. It has a definition. 619 00:39:33.875 --> 00:39:34.275 Oh. 620 00:39:35.875 --> 00:39:38.195 Must depict or seem to originate from another 621 00:39:38.195 --> 00:39:43.620 dimension, must either be surreal or bizarre, or attempt 622 00:39:43.620 --> 00:39:47.380 to convey a novel emotion or experience. Which I think that 623 00:39:47.380 --> 00:39:49.460 that aligns with everything that we've said so Yeah. 624 00:39:50.020 --> 00:39:51.140 Asked and answered. 625 00:39:51.140 --> 00:39:53.220 Who hasn't had that novel experience? 626 00:39:57.115 --> 00:39:59.275 Alright. I wanna ask the room real quick before 627 00:39:59.275 --> 00:40:04.395 you if I say wacky Tic Tac, do you know what that means? Wacky 628 00:40:04.395 --> 00:40:05.195 Tic Tac? 629 00:40:05.275 --> 00:40:07.595 Wacky Tic Tac? No. I don't want to. 630 00:40:07.595 --> 00:40:09.435 No. She said nervously. 631 00:40:09.595 --> 00:40:13.470 Okay. Well, we're going back to Reddit. Uh-huh. 632 00:40:13.470 --> 00:40:17.310 Georgia, can you please read the description of it before you 633 00:40:17.310 --> 00:40:17.630 open it? 634 00:40:17.630 --> 00:40:19.790 Oh my god. Okay. Okay. 635 00:40:20.430 --> 00:40:22.270 We're off to such a good start. 636 00:40:22.270 --> 00:40:23.230 We really are. 637 00:40:23.710 --> 00:40:26.830 I have seen the face of god and it was weeping. 638 00:40:27.605 --> 00:40:28.325 Banana. 639 00:40:28.485 --> 00:40:30.005 Okay. Now you know where we are? Yeah. 640 00:40:30.005 --> 00:40:32.165 Let's open that up. Oh. 641 00:40:32.485 --> 00:40:34.645 Say it the way the wacky Tic Tacs would 642 00:40:34.645 --> 00:40:35.525 have you say it. 643 00:40:35.765 --> 00:40:37.765 Banana. Yes. 644 00:40:39.445 --> 00:40:40.565 Yeah. We're in minion land. 645 00:40:40.580 --> 00:40:43.620 Yeah. We're I'm I'm in the minion system. I'm in 646 00:40:43.620 --> 00:40:44.500 the walls. 647 00:40:45.140 --> 00:40:45.700 Yeah. 648 00:40:46.900 --> 00:40:52.100 Okay. So just going through here, it's it's 649 00:40:52.100 --> 00:40:55.915 all sorts of content involving minions. The kind that as you 650 00:40:55.915 --> 00:40:58.715 may imagine, oh, wait. Never mind. 651 00:40:59.035 --> 00:41:02.475 Right? Your expectation got subverted. 652 00:41:02.475 --> 00:41:03.195 It's So 653 00:41:03.195 --> 00:41:05.435 you start and you're like, this is this is a 654 00:41:05.435 --> 00:41:06.475 grandma on Facebook. 655 00:41:06.475 --> 00:41:09.275 Okay. It's just literally about to say, your 656 00:41:09.275 --> 00:41:13.320 aunt on Facebook was like, happy Tuesday everyone. God bless 657 00:41:13.320 --> 00:41:14.200 America. 658 00:41:14.520 --> 00:41:18.680 Yeah. These are no But like if minions were the 659 00:41:18.680 --> 00:41:21.560 thing that lives behind the diner in Mulholland Drive. 660 00:41:22.040 --> 00:41:26.355 Oh my god. And what's funny is that not all of 661 00:41:26.355 --> 00:41:29.555 them have been so we should say what is what's going on here is 662 00:41:29.555 --> 00:41:33.155 that they're yes. It's this format of, you know, minion 663 00:41:33.155 --> 00:41:34.755 photos photos. 664 00:41:37.155 --> 00:41:38.035 Like in TikTok. It's documentary. 665 00:41:39.700 --> 00:41:42.260 Documentary of the real creature minions that 666 00:41:42.260 --> 00:41:46.900 live among us. Images of minions, you know, with wigs or 667 00:41:46.900 --> 00:41:51.860 making a funny face or pointing at themselves and has the sort 668 00:41:51.860 --> 00:41:54.740 of structure of of what we were just describing of, like, you 669 00:41:54.740 --> 00:41:56.385 know, sometimes a girl just needs 670 00:41:56.385 --> 00:41:59.665 to let loose or whatever. But but every, one 671 00:41:59.665 --> 00:42:02.225 that I'm seeing now, actually, I was wrong. They're all like 672 00:42:02.225 --> 00:42:02.785 this. 673 00:42:02.785 --> 00:42:03.585 They're all like 674 00:42:03.585 --> 00:42:06.065 this. So, like, you know, a couple down, is two 675 00:42:06.065 --> 00:42:09.745 minions smiling at at you and sort of pointing at themselves 676 00:42:09.745 --> 00:42:13.710 and it says, exercise? I thought you said, and then someone 677 00:42:13.710 --> 00:42:17.310 clearly superimposed over whatever it originally said, 678 00:42:17.470 --> 00:42:19.150 Bush did nine eleven. 679 00:42:19.950 --> 00:42:23.070 The, the title of the post would seem to suggest 680 00:42:23.070 --> 00:42:26.590 that what is, covered over is extra fries. 681 00:42:27.045 --> 00:42:30.165 Yes. Because the the caption is no extra 682 00:42:30.165 --> 00:42:31.205 fries today. 683 00:42:31.365 --> 00:42:33.445 Now, that's funny. I like that. This George 684 00:42:33.445 --> 00:42:35.845 Bush two nine eleven thing, I'm not sure about that quite as 685 00:42:35.845 --> 00:42:36.165 much. 686 00:42:36.165 --> 00:42:38.885 You have like under the title God has abandoned us, 687 00:42:39.320 --> 00:42:43.480 you have a very grainy hungover minion that says exercise? I 688 00:42:43.480 --> 00:42:46.120 sell a 130 grams of crack cocaine behind my local middle 689 00:42:46.120 --> 00:42:48.920 school, run over 21 innocent children with a hijacked bus, 690 00:42:49.000 --> 00:42:52.360 evade $82,000 in taxes, and commit severe war crimes in Iraq 691 00:42:52.360 --> 00:42:54.955 every day. That counts. Right? 692 00:42:55.035 --> 00:42:59.835 Yeah. There's a lot of, like, a newly restored 693 00:42:59.835 --> 00:43:03.355 World War one photo that is what looks like an already AI 694 00:43:03.355 --> 00:43:07.995 generated black and white image of soldiers on the battlefield, 695 00:43:07.995 --> 00:43:16.220 and then a minion storming alongside them. My god. 696 00:43:16.700 --> 00:43:19.420 And so it keeps going, and there's a it's a wide 697 00:43:19.420 --> 00:43:22.620 variety. It's not all political. There's like a cuck life one. 698 00:43:22.620 --> 00:43:23.900 Mhmm. There's all of these. 699 00:43:24.125 --> 00:43:27.725 It's but it's like it's like your auntie is the filthiest 700 00:43:27.725 --> 00:43:32.365 person who like the filthiest tin hattiness wearing person and 701 00:43:32.365 --> 00:43:37.165 is still into the same aesthetic. And the whole thing 702 00:43:37.165 --> 00:43:40.500 is wacky Tic Tacs, which I looked up, there is such a thing 703 00:43:40.500 --> 00:43:43.380 as a Minion Tic Tac. They're banana flavored, which 704 00:43:43.220 --> 00:43:43.540 Of course. 705 00:43:43.540 --> 00:43:47.540 There are 97,000 people in this, and the title is 706 00:43:47.540 --> 00:43:48.580 God is Dead. 707 00:43:48.660 --> 00:43:54.765 This does have a sort of sheen of a a 4chan or 708 00:43:54.765 --> 00:43:56.365 4chan adjacent. 709 00:43:56.445 --> 00:43:59.725 It's just it just is just leaning so hard into the 710 00:43:59.725 --> 00:44:01.085 irony of, 711 00:44:01.485 --> 00:44:01.805 you know, 712 00:44:01.805 --> 00:44:04.685 the minions are from Despicable Me, they're 713 00:44:04.685 --> 00:44:09.030 funny little guys, they're, you know, innocent, strange little 714 00:44:09.030 --> 00:44:13.350 characters. And now, you know, here's a book they're next to 715 00:44:13.350 --> 00:44:17.110 Bush did nine eleven and on a image that says, have one finger 716 00:44:17.110 --> 00:44:21.645 for a reason, woodworking accident. Like, it's just That's 717 00:44:21.645 --> 00:44:21.965 one of 718 00:44:21.965 --> 00:44:24.045 the more like, you know, palatable ones. 719 00:44:24.045 --> 00:44:26.365 Yeah. One of the most palatable. Yeah. Yeah. And 720 00:44:26.365 --> 00:44:27.005 I agree. 721 00:44:27.005 --> 00:44:30.045 Like, it it's it's very much that kind of like that 4chan 722 00:44:30.045 --> 00:44:32.925 style of ironic distance or ironic detachment. 723 00:44:33.810 --> 00:44:37.170 So this is really just an a repeated joke over and 724 00:44:37.170 --> 00:44:40.770 over, if I'm understanding correctly, of isn't it funny to 725 00:44:40.770 --> 00:44:47.970 put these cute little memed up things in actually despicable 726 00:44:47.970 --> 00:44:48.450 situations? 727 00:44:49.215 --> 00:44:51.135 Yes. It's people making fun of Facebook 728 00:44:51.135 --> 00:44:56.895 aunties by, you know, imagining what if they were edge lords. 729 00:44:57.295 --> 00:44:59.695 Edge lord is exactly the word. Because this 730 00:44:59.695 --> 00:45:02.880 is sort of a classic, like, internet Right. 731 00:45:02.880 --> 00:45:05.440 Vibe. This is like terminal posting, you know? 732 00:45:05.440 --> 00:45:06.080 Like, this is 733 00:45:06.160 --> 00:45:07.040 Yeah. Yes. 734 00:45:07.040 --> 00:45:08.640 This is endgame posting. 735 00:45:08.960 --> 00:45:10.000 Yeah. Yeah. 736 00:45:10.080 --> 00:45:12.560 Okay. Well, thanks. That's that's helpful. It's sort 737 00:45:12.560 --> 00:45:14.400 of what I thought, but it's a lot more. 738 00:45:14.560 --> 00:45:16.800 And it's really validating to know that a wacky 739 00:45:16.800 --> 00:45:18.785 TikTok is not commonly known. 740 00:45:18.785 --> 00:45:20.785 That's what's going on here? 741 00:45:21.585 --> 00:45:24.145 We've learned what's going on here, but at 742 00:45:24.145 --> 00:45:25.025 what cost? 743 00:45:28.865 --> 00:45:31.745 We've got one more what's going on here, but 744 00:45:31.745 --> 00:45:35.000 we are going to lose one Georgia Hampton because she's got 745 00:45:35.000 --> 00:45:36.920 somewhere more important to be right now. 746 00:45:37.160 --> 00:45:41.400 I gotta go kill all the minions. Oh, no. I'm 747 00:45:41.400 --> 00:45:43.400 stopping this once and for all. 748 00:45:43.400 --> 00:45:45.960 Georgia, thank you for joining us. Bye. 749 00:45:46.520 --> 00:45:47.320 Godspeed. 750 00:45:47.320 --> 00:45:51.815 Okay. I have something that I first 751 00:45:51.815 --> 00:45:56.615 encountered about a month ago. And I have been going out of my 752 00:45:56.615 --> 00:46:02.950 way. I wanna know what it is so bad. And I have not gone and 753 00:46:02.950 --> 00:46:06.470 searched to learn because I wanted to bring it to what's 754 00:46:06.470 --> 00:46:07.350 going on here. 755 00:46:08.070 --> 00:46:12.070 From what I can figure out, this is not new. 756 00:46:12.150 --> 00:46:12.790 Okay. 757 00:46:12.950 --> 00:46:17.635 By this, I mean, a a person. This person. I get 758 00:46:17.635 --> 00:46:22.995 served their videos all the time and like everywhere. And I think 759 00:46:22.995 --> 00:46:25.955 it's probably because I watch them because I'm like, what? I 760 00:46:25.955 --> 00:46:27.875 mean, it's the name of the segment for a reason. 761 00:46:27.955 --> 00:46:29.235 What is going on here? 762 00:46:29.740 --> 00:46:31.420 And the algorithm is like, this guy loves 763 00:46:31.420 --> 00:46:31.900 this. This guy 764 00:46:31.900 --> 00:46:37.180 loves this. So, Jason. Yeah. I have four videos. 765 00:46:37.420 --> 00:46:38.140 Okay. 766 00:46:38.140 --> 00:46:40.140 And this is the first one. 767 00:46:40.700 --> 00:46:45.615 Okay. The name, Sufi Blower. What we have 768 00:46:45.615 --> 00:46:50.575 here is a man with a microphone. When I press play, we'll figure 769 00:46:50.575 --> 00:46:55.855 out what he does with that power. It's in a public space, a 770 00:46:55.855 --> 00:46:57.055 crowded public space. 771 00:46:58.140 --> 00:47:05.100 A lot of folks have their hands on their foreheads. Is that him 772 00:47:05.100 --> 00:47:10.620 making this noise? Okay. He's like sort of beatboxing a little 773 00:47:10.620 --> 00:47:10.780 bit. 774 00:47:11.445 --> 00:47:14.005 It feels like he's like slamming his diaphragm, 775 00:47:14.005 --> 00:47:16.245 like his abdomen to make his diaphragm work. 776 00:47:16.245 --> 00:47:18.405 Yeah. He's engaging his diaphragm with his 777 00:47:18.405 --> 00:47:21.445 hands. He's sort of like I need a pan down here, but looks like 778 00:47:21.445 --> 00:47:23.685 he's kind of chilling his belly and 779 00:47:23.925 --> 00:47:24.245 Yeah. 780 00:47:26.130 --> 00:47:28.850 Okay. I'm gonna send you a second video. 781 00:47:28.930 --> 00:47:30.610 I just watched this man on Facebook, 782 00:47:30.610 --> 00:47:38.370 now to TikTok. Okay. Because he was doing his hands. Okay. He's 783 00:47:38.370 --> 00:47:42.495 sort of pulling at a necklace, a rope, round beaded. 784 00:47:42.815 --> 00:47:45.535 Perhaps beaded is hard to see, I need better fidelity on these 785 00:47:45.535 --> 00:47:48.895 buddy. And he's doing that same deep breath thing into a 786 00:47:48.895 --> 00:47:53.295 microphone in a public setting and this one has like a delay 787 00:47:52.890 --> 00:47:55.770 slapped to it and a big reverb. There 788 00:47:56.170 --> 00:47:58.570 are people screaming in the background, 789 00:47:58.570 --> 00:48:00.730 like scream, like someone's being attacked. 790 00:48:00.730 --> 00:48:02.250 Yes. Okay. And the same we pan to the 791 00:48:02.250 --> 00:48:04.730 crowd, they have their hands on their heads again, they're 792 00:48:04.730 --> 00:48:05.450 screaming. 793 00:48:05.690 --> 00:48:10.905 And the crowd is huge. Huge. How is this how 794 00:48:10.905 --> 00:48:13.225 would you describe this man's manner of dress? 795 00:48:13.625 --> 00:48:16.185 He's got he's got a black head wrap, but like 796 00:48:16.185 --> 00:48:18.425 a multi colored sort of set of robes. 797 00:48:18.585 --> 00:48:21.065 And someone else is holding the microphone in 798 00:48:21.065 --> 00:48:21.865 front of him. Right. 799 00:48:22.560 --> 00:48:24.480 I mean, I would call it like a ceremonial 800 00:48:24.480 --> 00:48:26.880 robe even, like there are religious overtones to this 801 00:48:26.880 --> 00:48:32.000 certainly, but I don't have the cultural conversants to know. 802 00:48:32.160 --> 00:48:34.480 To say exactly Yeah. The article of clothing. 803 00:48:34.480 --> 00:48:35.200 Exactly. 804 00:48:35.440 --> 00:48:35.760 Mhmm. 805 00:48:36.725 --> 00:48:40.965 So here are two of his own videos. Okay. 806 00:48:44.805 --> 00:48:47.365 Oh, he's not hitting his diaphragm. 807 00:48:47.365 --> 00:48:49.685 No. He's not at all. He's just like fiddling 808 00:48:49.685 --> 00:48:54.300 with yanking this necklace, this beaded white beaded necklace. 809 00:48:54.300 --> 00:48:54.620 He's What about 810 00:48:54.620 --> 00:48:55.500 a rosary? 811 00:48:55.900 --> 00:48:57.500 Yeah. Yeah. It's a good That's a good way to 812 00:48:57.500 --> 00:49:00.220 describe it. It is basically essentially a rosary. I don't 813 00:49:00.220 --> 00:49:01.100 see a cross. 814 00:49:02.060 --> 00:49:05.145 And the comments on this one comments on this one include, 815 00:49:05.145 --> 00:49:07.705 I'm Christian but even I can tell this is not Islam and 816 00:49:07.705 --> 00:49:11.625 someone else saying this is not Islam. Someone else saying, I've 817 00:49:11.625 --> 00:49:14.345 been seeing this dude a lot in my feed lately, but why are 818 00:49:14.345 --> 00:49:17.970 women screaming while he spits into the mic? Really trying to 819 00:49:17.970 --> 00:49:19.810 underline that this is not Islam, which makes me think 820 00:49:19.810 --> 00:49:21.890 there are comments that have maybe been buried here where 821 00:49:21.890 --> 00:49:25.490 people are being unkind about Islam or making assumptions 822 00:49:25.490 --> 00:49:29.090 there. And those more than no are making sure that we know 823 00:49:29.090 --> 00:49:31.730 that no, that is not what is going on here. 824 00:49:31.955 --> 00:49:36.195 So based on just what I've seen from the comments 825 00:49:36.195 --> 00:49:40.755 of getting served these videos, is that this guy is a 826 00:49:41.155 --> 00:49:43.955 controversial spiritual leader of some kind. 827 00:49:44.310 --> 00:49:45.510 That's what I'm picking up. 828 00:49:45.510 --> 00:49:48.470 Yeah. Right? Related to Islam somehow. 829 00:49:49.430 --> 00:49:53.750 Perhaps tenuously in the eyes of a big group of people. I guess 830 00:49:53.750 --> 00:49:57.110 my question is like, why and what's the deal with the breath? 831 00:49:57.695 --> 00:50:04.495 Mhmm. But like, you know, going into a delay line while pulling 832 00:50:04.495 --> 00:50:07.695 on this necklace with people losing their minds. 833 00:50:08.415 --> 00:50:09.935 I mean, it certainly has, you know, 834 00:50:09.935 --> 00:50:14.190 overtones of some of our more ecstatic American traditions. 835 00:50:14.350 --> 00:50:15.870 Like speaking in tongues and 836 00:50:16.270 --> 00:50:19.230 tongues, or yelling, or the fun little slap 837 00:50:19.230 --> 00:50:21.390 the forehead and watch them crumble move. 838 00:50:21.390 --> 00:50:24.030 You know, his name is, I'm gonna say it 839 00:50:24.030 --> 00:50:27.310 probably very wrong, Haqqa'teb Hussein. 840 00:50:28.085 --> 00:50:30.805 Okay. So he's got a he's got a website. 841 00:50:30.885 --> 00:50:34.725 Serving humanity in the name of Allah SWT. Right? 842 00:50:35.205 --> 00:50:39.525 Every week, thousands of people make their way to Dab'ar e 843 00:50:39.525 --> 00:50:46.910 Aliyah Balawara Sharif and Astana Aliyahkar, Saddan. 844 00:50:46.990 --> 00:50:49.870 It seems to be Northeastern Pakistan. 845 00:50:50.110 --> 00:50:54.750 To receive Allah SWT's blessing through the doom 846 00:50:54.750 --> 00:51:00.065 and dua insufflation and supplication of Kaladar I Duran 847 00:51:00.065 --> 00:51:08.145 Haqqateb Hussein Ali Badshah Sakhar m e. So this is my sense 848 00:51:07.920 --> 00:51:11.280 and this was what I was hoping we could maybe figure out is 849 00:51:11.280 --> 00:51:16.480 like, is this guy like a Joel Osteen who is, you know, 850 00:51:16.480 --> 00:51:20.320 nominally associated with some religion, but really is just 851 00:51:20.825 --> 00:51:24.265 enriching himself. Yeah. But that still doesn't answer the 852 00:51:24.265 --> 00:51:26.985 question of like, why these elements? Like, I I wanna 853 00:51:26.985 --> 00:51:29.945 understand the beads and the breathing and the hands on the 854 00:51:29.945 --> 00:51:30.985 forehead Yeah. 855 00:51:30.985 --> 00:51:34.340 And the like kneeling with the hands behind the head. I'm sure 856 00:51:34.340 --> 00:51:37.620 all of this is, like, deeply rooted in, like, religious 857 00:51:37.620 --> 00:51:40.100 symbolism that we just are not familiar with. 858 00:51:40.100 --> 00:51:44.260 Yeah. Mhmm. I'm just I'm poking around more at 859 00:51:44.260 --> 00:51:47.380 the website, at this man's website, and there's a thing 860 00:51:47.380 --> 00:51:57.575 called Wazifa Taspeh, which is curative. And it says, to cure 861 00:51:57.575 --> 00:52:00.855 ill cure from illnesses, solution to problems or worries, 862 00:52:00.855 --> 00:52:03.790 righteous offspring income slash job, peace and blessings in the 863 00:52:03.790 --> 00:52:05.870 home, righteous marriages of children, etcetera, in the 864 00:52:05.870 --> 00:52:09.550 essence for all good, righteous purposes. When? 865 00:52:09.710 --> 00:52:14.910 To be recited after Namaz ESR. How? After Namaz ESR, recite 866 00:52:14.910 --> 00:52:22.725 Durud e 11 times, Surah Kothar 100 times, followed by 11 times. 867 00:52:22.725 --> 00:52:25.285 So you have this pattern of recitation that you need to do. 868 00:52:26.085 --> 00:52:28.980 And then following the completion of Wazifa, you can 869 00:52:28.980 --> 00:52:31.860 make dua for yourself or anyone else for any good purpose. 870 00:52:31.860 --> 00:52:37.060 It is it is also allowed to blow upon to insufflate water after 871 00:52:37.060 --> 00:52:39.940 completing this wazifah and to drink it or to give the 872 00:52:39.940 --> 00:52:44.155 insufflated water to some patient to drink, any illness 873 00:52:44.155 --> 00:52:48.555 will subside. Mhmm. So you're making an elixir with your 874 00:52:48.555 --> 00:52:52.475 breath, and I wonder if that's the idea is he's breathing he's 875 00:52:52.475 --> 00:52:56.475 making his breath after he's done this cleansing ritual is 876 00:52:56.475 --> 00:52:59.035 being breathed upon all of the crowds. Right. 877 00:52:59.410 --> 00:53:02.450 Naturally, in the way that air does get 878 00:53:02.450 --> 00:53:07.810 amplified and moved Yeah. Through the microphone. Yeah. 879 00:53:07.810 --> 00:53:09.970 There's a healing tab on his page where some of these 880 00:53:09.970 --> 00:53:14.085 miracles are listed that I have found now. Things that he claims 881 00:53:14.085 --> 00:53:17.205 to have done, or this website claims that he has done include, 882 00:53:17.205 --> 00:53:20.725 a little boy had hole in his heart cured. 883 00:53:20.725 --> 00:53:23.525 After four and the dom the dom is the is the breath 884 00:53:23.525 --> 00:53:24.165 water. 885 00:53:24.485 --> 00:53:27.340 Okay. Cured after four dom. Man suffering 886 00:53:27.340 --> 00:53:31.020 from incurable jaundice of the liver is cured. Girl who lost 887 00:53:31.020 --> 00:53:34.620 her sight for seven months recovers her eyesight. Epilepsy, 888 00:53:34.620 --> 00:53:37.820 liver cancer, village had wells of hard water. 889 00:53:38.315 --> 00:53:41.915 Someone couldn't speak for fifteen years. These are among 890 00:53:41.915 --> 00:53:44.075 the victories that he is tallying up. 891 00:53:44.155 --> 00:53:45.995 So you can participate live and have these 892 00:53:45.995 --> 00:53:48.555 healing properties expelled at you. 893 00:53:48.635 --> 00:53:51.995 Little girl got dumb from Facebook live. 894 00:53:51.995 --> 00:53:52.315 Yeah. 895 00:53:52.590 --> 00:53:54.510 She had been unable to walk and doctors 896 00:53:54.510 --> 00:53:56.590 declare she would never be able to walk again. She was able to 897 00:53:56.590 --> 00:53:58.750 walk from second to woah. 898 00:53:58.990 --> 00:54:00.590 I don't know, man. Yeah. May yeah. Maybe I am 899 00:54:00.590 --> 00:54:02.990 cynical. Like, maybe they are purporting that this happens 900 00:54:02.990 --> 00:54:04.510 over the Internet as well. 901 00:54:04.725 --> 00:54:07.205 And Yeah. This is an earnest effort to provide healing and 902 00:54:07.205 --> 00:54:10.565 that they believe they are providing through all of man's 903 00:54:10.565 --> 00:54:12.885 available resources including the social web. 904 00:54:12.965 --> 00:54:14.645 There's a long tradition of this in both 905 00:54:14.645 --> 00:54:18.565 religious and secular spaces. I mean, placebos are a thing Yeah. 906 00:54:18.645 --> 00:54:21.170 And not just, you know, I don't know, maybe this is working for 907 00:54:21.170 --> 00:54:23.090 people, but people have been doing this, laying hands on 908 00:54:23.090 --> 00:54:25.410 people, doing all I mean, that's the big tent thing, you know. 909 00:54:25.410 --> 00:54:27.970 Yeah. I mean, ultimately, think, you know, we 910 00:54:27.970 --> 00:54:33.090 are probably waiting into a contended area for which we have 911 00:54:33.090 --> 00:54:37.425 none of the signifiers lined up to figure out any sort of Yeah. 912 00:54:37.425 --> 00:54:40.145 Way finding. I think that's probably very right. 913 00:54:40.385 --> 00:54:43.825 Yeah. Audience, if you have things to tell us 914 00:54:43.825 --> 00:54:45.905 about this, I wanna know all about them. 915 00:54:46.310 --> 00:54:47.270 Wanna know more. 916 00:54:58.790 --> 00:55:03.030 Okay. I think we did it Hans, Jason. Thank you 917 00:55:01.725 --> 00:55:05.885 for puzzling through what goes on on the Internet. Thank you to 918 00:55:05.885 --> 00:55:10.045 Georgia in absentia. Audience, are there things that you see on 919 00:55:10.045 --> 00:55:14.685 the Internet about which you think what is going on here? 920 00:55:15.085 --> 00:55:19.990 Or if you your self know what is going on here and you have been 921 00:55:19.990 --> 00:55:25.110 shouting at your phone, at your car stereo, at your speaker in 922 00:55:25.110 --> 00:55:29.595 your kitchen At your loved ones. Turn those shouts into words in 923 00:55:29.595 --> 00:55:34.955 an email and send them to us and tell us. Tell us, please. What 924 00:55:34.955 --> 00:55:36.475 is going on here? 925 00:55:36.715 --> 00:55:37.835 Thank you, everybody. 926 00:55:37.915 --> 00:55:54.000 Thank you. Bye. Bye. Bye. Good night, everyone. 927 00:55:56.495 --> 00:55:59.535 It's a star studded hour with Ed McMahon. Careers 928 00:55:59.535 --> 00:56:02.335 are being launched on the million and a half dollar Star 929 00:56:02.335 --> 00:56:12.420 Search eighty six. Tuesday at 07:30 on thirty two. And now 930 00:56:12.420 --> 00:56:15.380 Channel thirty two brings you this thought for today. Speaking 931 00:56:15.380 --> 00:56:17.540 is Father Garrett Barton of St. 932 00:56:17.540 --> 00:56:18.500 Michael Church. 933 00:56:18.980 --> 00:56:23.215 Our whole being craves for the use of our own 934 00:56:23.215 --> 00:56:28.575 life to make it the life of someone else and someone else 935 00:56:28.575 --> 00:56:33.455 happy. And by helping them out, we're doing something for them, 936 00:56:34.015 --> 00:56:38.450 for our self, and for our supreme being. So you can't lose 937 00:56:38.450 --> 00:56:42.130 that way. And therefore, you got to put aside all the little 938 00:56:42.130 --> 00:56:45.730 things that are said and the little things that are done. As 939 00:56:45.730 --> 00:56:49.570 long as you are doing what you know is right, what else cares? 940 00:56:50.165 --> 00:56:55.605 What else matters? You're going to get rewarded, and I wish the 941 00:56:55.605 --> 00:56:59.205 good almighty would come down and really show us the rewards 942 00:56:59.205 --> 00:57:03.285 that you already have from all the good that you've done. The 943 00:57:03.285 --> 00:57:07.480 good Lord praises you, and if he didn't praise you, well, he'd 944 00:57:07.480 --> 00:57:12.760 let you know. So we can do lots and lots of good things. We can 945 00:57:12.760 --> 00:57:14.840 be so happy in helping other people. 946 00:57:15.480 --> 00:57:19.640 We can lift up this world and our little small world that we 947 00:57:19.640 --> 00:57:25.985 roam around. It can be so much wonderful if we make it so. And 948 00:57:25.985 --> 00:57:30.225 it doesn't take anyone but yourself to make up your mind. 949 00:57:30.545 --> 00:57:35.680 I'm going to do something about it so that tomorrow, the whole 950 00:57:35.680 --> 00:57:38.560 world, my world, will be different. 951 00:57:40.720 --> 00:57:42.960 You've been listening to the thought for today with 952 00:57:42.960 --> 00:57:45.440 Father Garrett Martin of Saint Michael Church. 953 00:58:41.065 --> 00:58:42.425 That is the show we have 954 00:58:42.425 --> 00:58:43.785 for you this week. We're gonna be back here in 955 00:58:43.785 --> 00:58:49.145 the main feed on Wednesday, July 2. A Neverpost membership is $4 956 00:58:49.145 --> 00:58:52.585 and I think you should go get one right now at neverpo dot s 957 00:58:52.585 --> 00:58:56.185 t. Neverpost's producers are Audrey Evans, Georgia Hampton, 958 00:58:56.340 --> 00:58:59.460 and the mysterious doctor first name last name. Our senior 959 00:58:59.460 --> 00:59:02.740 producer is Hans Buto. Our executive producer is Jason 960 00:59:02.740 --> 00:59:03.700 Oberholzer. 961 00:59:03.700 --> 00:59:09.795 And the show's host, that's me, is Mike Rugnetta. Through night 962 00:59:09.795 --> 00:59:14.035 lava like eyelids softly opening, the first cry of 963 00:59:14.035 --> 00:59:19.315 creation's volcano flickers. In the branches of your limbs, the 964 00:59:19.315 --> 00:59:24.450 premonitions build their twittering nests. Excerpt of 965 00:59:24.450 --> 00:59:29.410 Dancer by Nelly Sacks. Never Post is a production of charts 966 00:59:29.410 --> 00:59:30.290 and leisure. 967 00:59:30.770 --> 00:59:33.090 It's distributed by Radiotopia.